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Просто идиш
April 21st, 2005
09:53 pm
[deduska_gertsen]

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Перевести.
Помогите, пожалуйста - Как бы вы перевели такую фразу на русский:
"Mit dem keysers dokter geyt mit der meylakh rfal (я не понимаю, что это за слово, поэтому пишу, как оно пишется на идиш) aleyn".
Спасибо.

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From:duchifat
Date:April 21st, 2005 07:02 pm (UTC)
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...с дочкой императора.... с ангелом Рафаэлем....
(или царем Рафаэлем, в вашей записи не вполне ясно)
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From:duchifat
Date:April 21st, 2005 07:04 pm (UTC)
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Пардон... не "дочка", а "доктор", конечно.
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From:deduska_gertsen
Date:April 21st, 2005 09:34 pm (UTC)
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Ага, спасибо Вам.
From:simulacrum420
Date:April 22nd, 2005 04:13 pm (UTC)
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מיטגײן - сопровождать (дэр мэйлэх рефул алэйн гейт мытн кейсэрс доктэр; ыз эр, дэр мэйлэх, эйст эс, а Doppelgänger)...
From:simulacrum420
Date:April 22nd, 2005 04:21 pm (UTC)
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(молэх вот аводэ гевэйн бэсэр)
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From:anu_sag
Date:April 21st, 2005 08:59 pm (UTC)
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Дословно - "С царским лекарем приходит ангел Рафаэль". Мне такая пословица не встречалась, значит, видимо, что-то вроде "с телесным исцелением приходит и духовное" или, скажем, "с помощью от людей приходит и помощь с неба" или просто что-то типа "На Бога надейся, а сам не плошай".
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From:deduska_gertsen
Date:April 21st, 2005 09:34 pm (UTC)
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Ага, спасибо. Но все равно смысл не очень понимаю. А чем это ангел Рафаэль "знаменит"?
Там в рассказе, откуда фраза, речь о том, что царский лекарь может всех только своим присутствием без всяких лекарств вылечить, и что обычный лекарь ходит с ангелом, а царский прямо вот с ангелом Рафаэлем....
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From:anu_sag
Date:April 21st, 2005 09:43 pm (UTC)
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Ангел Рафаэль знаменит среди прочего и лечебными своими заслугами (видимо, это ему было приписано на основе народной этимологии его имени: "Рафаэль" связали с корнем рейш-пей-алеф: рофэ - врач, рефуа - лечение/лекарство/исцеление, и т.п.)
А тут, видимо, иерархия такая: обычному лекарю положен просто ангел, который и лечить-то не умеет, так что толку от них никакого, а царскому лекарю - Рафаэль, так что ему и лечить-то, в сущности, не надо.
Просторы для истолкования, как Вы понимаете, открываются необъятные.
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From:deduska_gertsen
Date:April 22nd, 2005 09:40 pm (UTC)
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Ага, ага... здорово ему.. все поняла, спасибо :)
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From:riftsh
Date:April 21st, 2005 10:27 pm (UTC)
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если речь идет о межиречском магиде и реб Якове из Вильны, то пророчество магида там заключалось в том, что королевского врача сопровождает главный лечебный ангел Рафаил, которые вместе могут все вылечить
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From:deduska_gertsen
Date:April 22nd, 2005 12:13 pm (UTC)
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Да, там о межеричском магиде и о неком миснагеде, которого там никак не зовут и не сказано, из какого он города.
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From:riftsh
Date:April 22nd, 2005 01:24 pm (UTC)
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вот, теперь будете знать, что миснагеда звали Яков и был он из Вильны. если хотите, могу прислать полный текст на языке, который Вы не любите знаете
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From:deduska_gertsen
Date:April 22nd, 2005 09:37 pm (UTC)
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Ой, да! пришлите, пжст! Интересно сравнить с тем, который я перевожу... с еврейского на человеческий. Пришлите пжст на meroe@yandex.ru. Буду оччень признательна :)
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From:riftsh
Date:April 22nd, 2005 10:28 pm (UTC)
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поскольку есть еще интересующиеся, кладу сюда (из "Talks and Tales", любавического детского журнала):

A prominent Jewish merchant, Reb Yaakov from Vilna, known to be an accomplished Torah scholar, once passed through Mezritch. Having heard of the greatness of the Mezritcher Maggid, Rabbi Dov Ber, Reb Yaakov decided to visit him, although he was not an adherent of the Chasidic movement. Reb Yaakov was eager to engage the Maggid in a learned discussion, and he was not disappointed. But, as Reb Yaakov had no interest in Chasidic philosophy, the subject was not broached.

As Reb Yaakov was about to leave, the Maggid suddenly said: "Remember Yaakov, what our Sages of blessed memory said, that G-d sends His cure to a patient through a particular doctor and a particular medicine. Sometimes the One Above sends His cure not through the medication which the doctor prescribes, but through the doctor himself. As you know, a doctor receives his healing powers by authority of the Divine Torah, as it is written, 'And he shall surely cure him.' Therefore, the doctor has a healing angel at his side, and a very great doctor is accompanied by the chief healing angel, Rafael, himself."

As he traveled back to Vilna, Reb Yaakov thought about this strange parting remark, which seemed to come out of the blue. Reb Yaakov was, thank G-d, in very good health. He had never needed a doctor before, and he hoped he would not have to consult one in the future. He hadn't asked the Maggid for medical advice, so why had the Maggid mentioned doctors? Unable to solve this puzzle, he soon dismissed the entire episode from his mind.

Several weeks later Reb Yaakov returned home and soon fell into his normal routine. After a few days, he awoke feeling quite ill. His condition worsened rapidly and although all the best doctors were called in, each offering a different medication, nothing helped.

Word of his condition spread quickly. His friends and acquaintances were devastated, for Reb Yaakov was a kind and charitable man. Then a ray of hope appeared. The Jews of Vilna heard that the king would be arriving in town, and his personal physician, who was a wayward Jew, would be accompanying him. If only they could persuade the king's doctor to pay a call on their beloved friend, maybe this great doctor could save his life.

The community leaders dispatched a delegation to the king and petitioned him to allow his royal physician to visit Reb Yaakov. The king received them graciously and agreed to their request. The hopes of his family and friends soared when the famous doctor entered the sickroom, but were soon dashed. When the doctor looked at Reb Yaakov he said disdainfully, "Am I G-d that you have brought me here to revive a dead man?"

To everyone's horror, the doctor turned to leave. The distraught family begged him to prescribe some medication. "Nothing can help this man," he replied brusquely, casting a parting glance at the dying patient. But something caught his eye and he turned to look again. A slight bit of color could be seen on the patient's pale face. The doctor quickly took his notepad and scribbled a prescription. "Run to the pharmacy and bring this medication at once!"

Hope sprang again into the hearts of the man's family and friends. The royal physician remained at the man's bedside, his eyes fixed on the sick man. He was amazed to see further signs of improvement. He pulled out his pad and prescribed another medication. But no sooner had he written it out than the patient's eyes began to flicker. The doctor had never seen such a thing in all his experience. Suddenly, the erstwhile dying man sat up in bed and addressed the physician, "I beg you, dear doctor, don't go yet. Stay a while longer, and I'll feel much better. The Angel Rafael must be at your side."

(продолжение следует)
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From:riftsh
Date:April 22nd, 2005 10:30 pm (UTC)
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(продолжение)

The physician was completely overwhelmed. He stared at the patient in utter disbelief, and although he didn't believe in angels, he could almost believe the patient's words. As if reading the doctor's thoughts, Reb Yaakov began to relate his visit to the Maggid of Mezritch and especially the Maggid's puzzling remark at the end of the visit.

"I can see now, that his remark was completely prophetic and true," Reb Yaakov remarked.

The king's doctor, who had listened intently to the whole episode, sat engrossed in thought. It occurred to him that, great healer though he was, he needed a lot of healing himself -- healing of a spiritual nature.

"I would like to meet this saintly man," he finally said. "When you are fully recovered, I would like you to take me to meet him."

Not very long after, the two of them, Reb Yaakov and the king's physician, traveled to Mezritch -- Reb Yaakov to become a Chasid and the physician to return to his faith.


гут шабес ун а фрейлехн пейсах!
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From:bredstein
Date:April 22nd, 2005 10:12 pm (UTC)

text

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A mozhno vklinitsya? Ya etu maysu pripominayu, slishal gde-to na idish... ili tshital - ne pomnyu uzhe gde. Esli Vash tekst na ivrite, ne mogli bi mne pereslat na bredstein@mail.utexas.edu? Zaranee blagodaren,

Andrey

א כשרן פסח
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From:riftsh
Date:April 22nd, 2005 10:33 pm (UTC)

Re: text

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From:(Anonymous)
Date:April 21st, 2005 11:01 pm (UTC)
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Г-ди, почему тут так хорошо бывает! По одному вопросу в день, с ответами, это же возможно?
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